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Hamilton2
At the 2:00 mark in the 2nd Quarter of HAM vs. CHA, HAM drops back to throw the ball deep and the CHA defense "keys" on the play. But I do not understand why.
First of all, I thought that "keying" was turned off during the final 2 minutes of each half, due to the unique nature of end-of-half/game play calling?
Secondly, this was the reverse play sequence for HAM prior to the "keying" taking place, and it doesn't make sense that the defense would expect a deep pass there.
1) The deep pass in question, this is the play they keyed.
2) An encroachment penalty (shouldn't even count, since no real play was run)
3) Punt
4) A deep pass (this would be #2 counting towards the keying)
5, 6, 7, 8, and 9) Running plays (yes, 5 consecutive running plays)
10) A 20-yard completion
So ... unless the sim is counting back 10 plays instead of 5, I don't see any way that the defense would/could recognize a deep pass and "key in" on the above sequence.
What am I missing here?
How is the defense "keyed in" here?
October 15, 2012 at 12:30AM View BBCode
http://footballbeta.simdynasty.com/boxscore.jsp?boxscoreid=24393&thid=2310&qtr=2At the 2:00 mark in the 2nd Quarter of HAM vs. CHA, HAM drops back to throw the ball deep and the CHA defense "keys" on the play. But I do not understand why.
First of all, I thought that "keying" was turned off during the final 2 minutes of each half, due to the unique nature of end-of-half/game play calling?
Secondly, this was the reverse play sequence for HAM prior to the "keying" taking place, and it doesn't make sense that the defense would expect a deep pass there.
1) The deep pass in question, this is the play they keyed.
2) An encroachment penalty (shouldn't even count, since no real play was run)
3) Punt
4) A deep pass (this would be #2 counting towards the keying)
5, 6, 7, 8, and 9) Running plays (yes, 5 consecutive running plays)
10) A 20-yard completion
So ... unless the sim is counting back 10 plays instead of 5, I don't see any way that the defense would/could recognize a deep pass and "key in" on the above sequence.
What am I missing here?
Hamilton2
October 15, 2012 at 12:33AM View BBCode
Furthermore, it is my understanding that any time that the sim is going to let the defense "key in" it gives the offense another chance (or multiple chances) to call a different play, since the goal is to punish abuse but allow for variations if needed by a person who gets caught by the "key" on accident. According to my strategy tester, in that situation, I would be 10% likely to call a long shotgun pass. 10%. Why didn't we just run a different play?
Hamilton2
October 15, 2012 at 12:35AM View BBCode
OK. Now I am even more confused. We lined up in the pro set and he dropped back to pass. That isn't even an option on my play calling strategies. Sometimes, I have no clue at all what this football sim even does.
Admin
Are you talking about a different play? The play at Q2/2:00 was lined up in a Shotgun.
I am looking into the rest of your post now.
Chris
October 15, 2012 at 02:38AM View BBCode
Originally posted by Hamilton2
OK. Now I am even more confused. We lined up in the pro set and he dropped back to pass. That isn't even an option on my play calling strategies. Sometimes, I have no clue at all what this football sim even does.
Are you talking about a different play? The play at Q2/2:00 was lined up in a Shotgun.
I am looking into the rest of your post now.
Chris
Admin
It is turned off in the final 90 seconds of each half.
Chris
[Edited on 10-15-2012 by Admin]
October 15, 2012 at 02:46AM View BBCode
Originally posted by Hamilton2
First of all, I thought that "keying" was turned off during the final 2 minutes of each half, due to the unique nature of end-of-half/game play calling?
It is turned off in the final 90 seconds of each half.
Chris
[Edited on 10-15-2012 by Admin]
Admin
It counted #2. The plan is stored before the snap. In this case since the penalty occurs before the snap, the play did not have a chance to develop, so the defense never sees it; however, it is already recorded in the plan log. I don't have a good way to fish it back out; I will need to figure one out, though, as you are right, this shouldn't count.
Also, I think the threshold is triggering earlier than it should. I think I tightened this down intentionally at one time, but it really should be a notch less sensitive.
Chris
October 15, 2012 at 03:00AM View BBCode
Originally posted by Hamilton2
Secondly, this was the reverse play sequence for HAM prior to the "keying" taking place, and it doesn't make sense that the defense would expect a deep pass there.
1) The deep pass in question, this is the play they keyed.
2) An encroachment penalty (shouldn't even count, since no real play was run)
3) Punt
4) A deep pass (this would be #2 counting towards the keying)
5, 6, 7, 8, and 9) Running plays (yes, 5 consecutive running plays)
10) A 20-yard completion
So ... unless the sim is counting back 10 plays instead of 5, I don't see any way that the defense would/could recognize a deep pass and "key in" on the above sequence.
What am I missing here?
It counted #2. The plan is stored before the snap. In this case since the penalty occurs before the snap, the play did not have a chance to develop, so the defense never sees it; however, it is already recorded in the plan log. I don't have a good way to fish it back out; I will need to figure one out, though, as you are right, this shouldn't count.
Also, I think the threshold is triggering earlier than it should. I think I tightened this down intentionally at one time, but it really should be a notch less sensitive.
Chris
Admin
The code for this looks correct; I am putting in extra logging to make sure it is correct. Of course it is possible for a 10% play to be repeatedly selected, but with the extra logs I'll make sure there isn't a seeding issue.
Chris
October 15, 2012 at 03:28AM View BBCode
Originally posted by Hamilton2
Furthermore, it is my understanding that any time that the sim is going to let the defense "key in" it gives the offense another chance (or multiple chances) to call a different play, since the goal is to punish abuse but allow for variations if needed by a person who gets caught by the "key" on accident. According to my strategy tester, in that situation, I would be 10% likely to call a long shotgun pass. 10%. Why didn't we just run a different play?
The code for this looks correct; I am putting in extra logging to make sure it is correct. Of course it is possible for a 10% play to be repeatedly selected, but with the extra logs I'll make sure there isn't a seeding issue.
Chris
tworoosters
Starting at the 6:30 mark of the 1st quarter Tennessee goes:
1st & 10 - Pro Set, run
2nd & 5 - Pro Set, play action pass
1st & 10 - Pro set, run
2nd & 5 - I formation, run
3rd & 8 - Pro Set, pass
punt
next possession
1st & 10 - Pro set, run
2nd & 11 - Shotgun, pass
3rd & inches - Pro Set, run
1st & 10 - Shotgun, The defense is keyed in ???????
What are they keyed in on ? The previous eight plays have featured 3 different formations with 5 runs, 2 passes and a play action .
October 15, 2012 at 09:00PM View BBCode
Here's another sequence from [url=http://footballbeta.simdynasty.com/boxscore.jsp?boxscoreid=24439&thid=2319]this game[/url].Starting at the 6:30 mark of the 1st quarter Tennessee goes:
1st & 10 - Pro Set, run
2nd & 5 - Pro Set, play action pass
1st & 10 - Pro set, run
2nd & 5 - I formation, run
3rd & 8 - Pro Set, pass
punt
next possession
1st & 10 - Pro set, run
2nd & 11 - Shotgun, pass
3rd & inches - Pro Set, run
1st & 10 - Shotgun, The defense is keyed in ???????
What are they keyed in on ? The previous eight plays have featured 3 different formations with 5 runs, 2 passes and a play action .
Admin
Chris
October 16, 2012 at 02:18AM View BBCode
The formation isn't the issue, it's the distance of the pass. Medium shotgun, medium sideline and medium pass are all lumped together, for example.Chris
RichNYC1
Also - the Hot Reads dont seem to be correct. I watched a bunch of games the last three days and it seems that when the QB cant find the read he does better than when he can. I saw it about 20 times. I would guess that about 7 out of 10 times when the QB "canīt find the read" heīs completed the pass and 4 of 10 times when he does find the read heīs completed the pass. Maybe itīs just my games, but itīs happened on both sides
October 16, 2012 at 02:53AM View BBCode
The keyed-In only works on long passes. I see almost no effect on Med or Short.Also - the Hot Reads dont seem to be correct. I watched a bunch of games the last three days and it seems that when the QB cant find the read he does better than when he can. I saw it about 20 times. I would guess that about 7 out of 10 times when the QB "canīt find the read" heīs completed the pass and 4 of 10 times when he does find the read heīs completed the pass. Maybe itīs just my games, but itīs happened on both sides
tworoosters
Regardless, how can they be "keyed in" when only 3 of the past eight plays have been passes ?
October 16, 2012 at 02:55AM View BBCode
Originally posted by Admin
The formation isn't the issue, it's the distance of the pass. Medium shotgun, medium sideline and medium pass are all lumped together, for example.
Chris
Regardless, how can they be "keyed in" when only 3 of the past eight plays have been passes ?
Admin
Because the punt doesn't count, and right now it can be triggered on the third play. It needs to be triggered on the fourth play.
Chris
October 16, 2012 at 03:30AM View BBCode
Originally posted by tworoosters
Regardless, how can they be "keyed in" when only 3 of the past eight plays have been passes ?
Because the punt doesn't count, and right now it can be triggered on the third play. It needs to be triggered on the fourth play.
Chris
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