celamantia
Player abilities
March 30, 2010 at 01:00AM View BBCode
Here is a brief overview of player abilities.
Because of the wide variety of roles played in football, it takes more abilities to describe a football player than a baseball player. Fortunately, only a subset of these abilities is really important to a particular position; however, because responsibilities can rapidly shift on the field of play during, say, an interception, a player may find all of his abilities being put to use at some point.
Abilities are divided into six groups: Offense, Defense, Special Teams, Physical, Mental, and Dexterity.
OFFENSE:
Throw Power - Self explanatory; generally controls how far a player can throw with reasonable accuracy, although it is occasionally used for short hard passes in traffic.
Throw Accuracy- Also self explanatory. Obviously mostly used by quarterbacks and occasionally running backs, but this is also a key ability for centers acting as long snappers as a long snap is essentially a 15-yard pass between the legs.
Carrying - The primary skill (other than speed) for a running back, simply measures how good a player is at running with the ball and protecting it.
Catching - The primary skill (other than speed) for a receiver, measures how good a player is at reeling in balls that are thrown.
Blocking - Measures how well a player can stay between a defender and the ball carrier.
DEFENSE:
Pass Cover - Measures how effective a player is at covering his receiver. Defenders running zone patterns lose a bit on their pass cover rating but can apply it from farther away.
Tackling - How well and how hard the player can apply the hit.
Pursuit - Supplements Speed when chasing the ball carrier, helps a player determine the best angle to take on the chase.
SPECIAL TEAMS:
Kick Power - Pretty self-explanatory... How far the ball can be kicked.
Kick Accuracy - How accurate the ball can be kicked. For placekickers, this is about putting the ball through the uprights or at the desired spot on a kickoff. For punters this is more about getting closest to the target angle (set in coach preferences) for balance between distance and hangtime, as well as keeping the ball out of the end zone when punting from inside the 45.
Kick Return - This skill is a combination of catching and running; specifically, it is about catching the ball coming from a much higher angle than a normal pass, quickly evaluating return routes, and transitioning from the catch to the return. It is used for the first 10-15 yards of the return, after which the normal carry/speed/agility formulas are used.
PHYSICAL:
Speed - Flat out running speed.
Strength - This is a combination of muscular strength and physical mass/inertia.
Jumping - Primarily used by receivers and those covering them; also used when a team is blocking a kick.
Stamina - This controls how quickly a player tires during a game, and how quickly a player bounces bback from fatigue.
Health - This is a measure of how injury-prone a player is.
Vision - Straddling the line between Physical and Mental, this covers the ability to see through the fog of players and overall awareness of the situation. It controls how much (and how accurate) the information used by that player's AI is, and controls a player's vulnerability to traps and stunts, fake handoffs, and other misleading play elements.
MENTAL:
Execution - This is sort of a "catch-all" ability. It defines how good a player is at doing the job of his position. When there is not a specific ability to cover a situation, Execution is usually used. For example, on a field goal kick, Kick Accuracy controls the actual direction of the kick while Execution handles the kicker's ability to compensate for the wind. Execution also can be thought of as "consistency" and "playmaking ability", as higher Execution players may occasionally get short-term bonuses that allow them to briefly play beyond their abilities. Finally, Execution is the major factor determining how prone a player is to penalties, especially "mental mistake" penalties like being called offsides.
Aggressiveness - The natural aggressiveness of a player. More aggressive defenders make harder hits but cause more penalties; more aggressive QB's may throw in less ideal situations, and thius may have more incompletes but fewer sacks and overall longer passes.
Attitude - This covers a lot of ground: work ethic, maturity, leadership, etc. It is a factor in improvements, contracts, and conditioning after injury.
DEXTERITY:
Agility - This is a combination of accelleration and ability to change direction quickly, including how deft a player is at avoiding tackles.
Break Tackle - If the player can't dodge the tackle quickly, this measures hoe well a player can squirm out of a tackle situation, either to break free or power forward for a last yard or two. It is also used by receivers to slough off defenders to avoid being jammed at the line of scrimmage.
Hands - In general tems, Hands indicates how fumble-prone a player is. In addition, this is the primary skill of a center (along with blocking) and for the holder during a place kick.
cowboymatt43
March 30, 2010 at 01:20AM View BBCode
Will agility be a factor with pass rushers, seeing as it seems to be in real life?
Better: What are the primary abilities for a pass rusher? To put it differently, which of these abilities will affect whether or not a player gets a sack?
Oh, and thanks! This looks fantastic!
[Edited on 3-30-2010 by cowboymatt43]
celamantia
March 30, 2010 at 01:59AM View BBCode
Originally posted by cowboymatt43
Better: What are the primary abilities for a pass rusher? To put it differently, which of these abilities will affect whether or not a player gets a sack?
Good question. I was saving this for another post, but may as well discuss it now.
I guess the easiest thing to do is simply post the formulas that are used to determine a player's overall rating at a role. Roles are distinct from positions as the indicate a particular place in a formation and a particular mission. Thus, there is no "position" for a Holder or a Long Snapper, but the formulas to determine overall rating at those roles are different from, say, a center or a QB.
Note that these formulas are subject to constant change as I refine the sim. Also note that Vision is relatively recent (I had been considering it part of Execution until I made it its own rating) so it only shows up in a couple of these formulas. Finally, some formula items are considered "key skills" where anything under a 40 is counted the same as 0, and some are "secondary" where anything over 90 does not contribute further to the rating. I'll mark key skills with a * and secondary skills with a ^.
QB: 25% Throw Acc*, 20% Throw Power*, 10% Execution, 10% Carry, 10% Hands, 10% Agility^, 5% Speed^, 5% Break Tackle^, 5% Vision
RB: 25% Speed, 20% Carry*, 20% Agility, 10% Catching^, 10% Execution, 10% Break Tackle, 5% Throw Accuracy^, 5% Vision
FB: 20% Blocking^, 15% Speed, 15% Carrying^, 15% Strength^, 10% Catching^, 10% Break Tackle, 5% Agility, 5% Execution, 5% Vision
(Note: Fullback is a role, not a position)
There's a lot of these, so I am going to just post a few at a time. :)
cowboymatt43
March 30, 2010 at 03:50PM View BBCode
That looks pretty cool. Thanks for sharing.
A couple of questions (not intended as criticism, just curious):
1. Does Hands for QBs impact how successful he takes the snap, whether under center or in shotgun?
2. Should Throw Acc be a part of a RBs overall? Or should it only come into play when you run a play in which the RB throws?
Again, thanks for your hard work!
celamantia
March 30, 2010 at 04:26PM View BBCode
Originally posted by cowboymatt43
1. Does Hands for QBs impact how successful he takes the snap, whether under center or in shotgun?
Yes, very much so.
2. Should Throw Acc be a part of a RBs overall? Or should it only come into play when you run a play in which the RB throws?
It only comes into play when he throws, but it still makes up part of his overall grade. That is why it is such a small part of his overall grade, and why it's marked as "secondary".
I should explain the "key skills" and "seconday skills" thing a bit more. Skills are meant to be absolute, or nearly so; they are not relative to a position. Thus, technically, any player can play any position (but they take a severe Execution hit for doing so). This creates a couple of issues with assigning an overall grade:
- With so many abilities going into an overall grade, you could max out secondary abilities with average key abilities and get, say, a B+ quarterback who can't actually throw.
- In some cases, a position may use a skill that players at that position will rarely have a very high score in, so that skill must be graded "on a curve". Take the Long Snapper role, for example. A long snap is a pass, and the long snapper needs Throw Accuracy to do it. But a Long Snapper is never going to have the Throw Accuracy of, say, a quarterback. They may have a Throw Accuracy of 75 or so, which is great
for a center. Thus, their Throw Accuracy is graded on a curve, using the Secondary Skill formula (although in this case it's really more of a primary skill).
The rating for a player in any role is always visible on his Player Card. Please pardon the gaps on this card, as I've been reworking it a bit so not all the fields are on it yet.
jgarcia8380
March 30, 2010 at 04:29PM View BBCode
Being a numbers geek, I hope there will leagues where player abilities show as numbers rather than letters as well. thanks for putting this together by the way
celamantia
March 30, 2010 at 05:00PM View BBCode
Yes, numbers leagues will be available as in Sim Dynasty Baseball.
cowboymatt43
March 30, 2010 at 05:55PM View BBCode
Thanks for the explanation and for showing the player card.
Looks really cool.
bpearly69
March 31, 2010 at 04:44PM View BBCode
this does look awesome, but I've always been a much better hands on learner, meaning I'm gonna have to play to really get the hang of this, reading some of this is giving me a headache :) just kind of confusing at first i suppose
emidas
March 31, 2010 at 07:10PM View BBCode
How will IC's work in relation to these skills and the position the player plays? Will they just be random like baseball, or will positions played have an effect?
celamantia
March 31, 2010 at 09:24PM View BBCode
IC's are related to the position, yes, and they are distributed in roughly the same proportions as they make up the overall grade.
Because much of a football player's time is spent in practice rather than on the field, though, it is possible to specify a different position in practice... this is really meant for special teams players. For example, a second-string running back may choose his weekly training in the "Kick Return" role. There are non-role training groups as well, such as "Conditioning" which spreads improves over strength, speed, health, and stamina.
don4593
May 14, 2010 at 09:20PM View BBCode
SimDynasty baseball isnt based in this decade but with SimDynasty football it will be. Now I have read through a lot of topics but one thing hasnt been covered.
Maybe you can consider another attribute that many teams consider when come draft day, character.
Now there there have been endless amounts of college players that were drafted despite their character flaws and some make it and some wont. There are a lot of variables to consider when determining whether a player will behave and follow rules and what not: Pedigree of a coach, leadership on the team, maybe a mentor at his position, the city he plays in and the media coverage it receives.
But I would propose that this follow the same rules as today's NFL. If a player breaks a rule he will get fined or suspended.
You could put a letter grade on that attribute like A+ character F character = high risk player and if you take that chance on him it could tarnish your teams reputation that would reflect poorly on your teams attendance and ability to and key free agents.
celamantia
May 14, 2010 at 09:46PM View BBCode
Originally posted by don4593
You could put a letter grade on that attribute like A+ character F character = high risk player and if you take that chance on him it could tarnish your teams reputation that would reflect poorly on your teams attendance and ability to and key free agents.
The Attitude attribute covers character-related issues. These specific types of issues won't exist in early drafts of the game but may find their way in with later versions as league options.
ChipArm
May 17, 2010 at 12:49AM View BBCode
Impressive effort.
After this one is complete, how about hockey?
celamantia
May 18, 2010 at 03:59AM View BBCode
I don't know a thing about hockey... I think the next sport on Tyson's list is likely basketball.
Metallica1828
June 02, 2010 at 02:26PM View BBCode
What about a kicker stat something like "clutch", that covers a kickers ability in very clutch situations.
Game on the line, 4th quarter, and the kicker has to hit the field goal...those situations really test an players ability in the "clutch"
Admin
June 04, 2010 at 05:10PM View BBCode
I think the next sport on Tyson's list is likely basketball.
Or perhaps Cricket. Or a non-sports game. Basketball and Hockey would have some similarities, but I would do Basketball first.
Tyson
happy
June 07, 2010 at 09:33PM View BBCode
A war game would be awesome. It also wouldnt require as much in the way of balancing to get MLB accurate stats.
celamantia
June 07, 2010 at 09:39PM View BBCode
Originally posted by happy
A war game would be awesome. It also wouldnt require as much in the way of balancing to get MLB accurate stats.
I had always wanted to do a game that was somewhere between Tradewars and VGA Planets, if anyone remembers those... there are a lot of games competing in that space, though, and hard to do one without having a licensed property to use.
Empire-style games are a good fit too... I have world/terrain generation code still from an old RPG I worked on for 10 years but abandoned after legal issues, I'd love to see that code finally have a day in the sun! :)
tworoosters
June 07, 2010 at 10:50PM View BBCode
Will players be able to switch positions ?
If so what will be the penalties, I'm thinking logical moves like an OLB playing DE, or a CB playing Safety, Guard to Tackle that sort of stuff .
Also I noticed you've just created one LB position, that seems too simplistic to me given the different skill sets required to played MLB (ILB) versus OLB.
celamantia
June 08, 2010 at 12:07AM View BBCode
Any player can theoretically play any position on the field.. The penalties are for the most part built into the ratings. There are, however, some restrictions:
- A player can only appear on a depth chart for a given position if he has at least a B- overall rating for that position.
- For Quarterback, the top position on the depth chart must be a native QB
- If you are playing out of position, you take a fairly severe Execution penalty (66% if I remember properly).
As far as positions that require different skill sets like Safety (FS vs SS) and Running Back (HB vs FB), players are created on different templates, so some of the running backs will be stronger blockers than runner, and some safeties will be built smaller and faster where others are built stronger.
Unfortunately, I don't have that sort of split for LB, though, and I agree that it is a flaw that I will need to address, as right now all defensive backs are too similar and to interchangeable. But it's a chicken and egg problem, I need to address the way defense is handled in the sim before I can fix the issue on the player level, so I'm deferring that for now.
[Edited on 6-8-2010 by celamantia]
celamantia
June 13, 2010 at 04:53AM View BBCode
I think I am going to remove Vision, as Execution (as I originally meant it) is meant to cover things like vision and awareness.
[Edited on 6-13-2010 by celamantia]
EdSales87
January 16, 2011 at 03:56PM View BBCode
Originally posted by celamantia
Here is a brief overview of player abilities.
Because of the wide variety of roles played in football, it takes more abilities to describe a football player than a baseball player. Fortunately, only a subset of these abilities is really important to a particular position; however, because responsibilities can rapidly shift on the field of play during, say, an interception, a player may find all of his abilities being put to use at some point.
Abilities are divided into six groups: Offense, Defense, Special Teams, Physical, Mental, and Dexterity.
OFFENSE:
Throw Power - Self explanatory; generally controls how far a player can throw with reasonable accuracy, although it is occasionally used for short hard passes in traffic.
Throw Accuracy- Also self explanatory. Obviously mostly used by quarterbacks and occasionally running backs, but this is also a key ability for centers acting as long snappers as a long snap is essentially a 15-yard pass between the legs.
Carrying - The primary skill (other than speed) for a running back, simply measures how good a player is at running with the ball and protecting it.
Catching - The primary skill (other than speed) for a receiver, measures how good a player is at reeling in balls that are thrown.
Blocking - Measures how well a player can stay between a defender and the ball carrier.
DEFENSE:
Pass Cover - Measures how effective a player is at covering his receiver. Defenders running zone patterns lose a bit on their pass cover rating but can apply it from farther away.
Tackling - How well and how hard the player can apply the hit.
Pursuit - Supplements Speed when chasing the ball carrier, helps a player determine the best angle to take on the chase.
SPECIAL TEAMS:
Kick Power - Pretty self-explanatory... How far the ball can be kicked.
Kick Accuracy - How accurate the ball can be kicked. For placekickers, this is about putting the ball through the uprights or at the desired spot on a kickoff. For punters this is more about getting closest to the target angle (set in coach preferences) for balance between distance and hangtime, as well as keeping the ball out of the end zone when punting from inside the 45.
Kick Return - This skill is a combination of catching and running; specifically, it is about catching the ball coming from a much higher angle than a normal pass, quickly evaluating return routes, and transitioning from the catch to the return. It is used for the first 10-15 yards of the return, after which the normal carry/speed/agility formulas are used.
PHYSICAL:
Speed - Flat out running speed.
Strength - This is a combination of muscular strength and physical mass/inertia.
Jumping - Primarily used by receivers and those covering them; also used when a team is blocking a kick.
Stamina - This controls how quickly a player tires during a game, and how quickly a player bounces bback from fatigue.
Health - This is a measure of how injury-prone a player is.
Vision - Straddling the line between Physical and Mental, this covers the ability to see through the fog of players and overall awareness of the situation. It controls how much (and how accurate) the information used by that player's AI is, and controls a player's vulnerability to traps and stunts, fake handoffs, and other misleading play elements.
MENTAL:
Execution - This is sort of a "catch-all" ability. It defines how good a player is at doing the job of his position. When there is not a specific ability to cover a situation, Execution is usually used. For example, on a field goal kick, Kick Accuracy controls the actual direction of the kick while Execution handles the kicker's ability to compensate for the wind. Execution also can be thought of as "consistency" and "playmaking ability", as higher Execution players may occasionally get short-term bonuses that allow them to briefly play beyond their abilities. Finally, Execution is the major factor determining how prone a player is to penalties, especially "mental mistake" penalties like being called offsides.
Aggressiveness - The natural aggressiveness of a player. More aggressive defenders make harder hits but cause more penalties; more aggressive QB's may throw in less ideal situations, and thius may have more incompletes but fewer sacks and overall longer passes.
Attitude - This covers a lot of ground: work ethic, maturity, leadership, etc. It is a factor in improvements, contracts, and conditioning after injury.
DEXTERITY:
Agility - This is a combination of accelleration and ability to change direction quickly, including how deft a player is at avoiding tackles.
Break Tackle - If the player can't dodge the tackle quickly, this measures hoe well a player can squirm out of a tackle situation, either to break free or power forward for a last yard or two. It is also used by receivers to slough off defenders to avoid being jammed at the line of scrimmage.
Hands - In general tems, Hands indicates how fumble-prone a player is. In addition, this is the primary skill of a center (along with blocking) and for the holder during a place kick.
Sorry I'm late to this conversation. I've played Sim Dynasty Baseball a few times. I'm big on building a team. I love football. So when I received an email about you guys were making a Football League, I was excited as all get out.
However, when I look at the player abilities, I'm a bit disappointed to be honest. It seems like the abilities are focused on the glamour positions in Football, QB, RB, WR. But what about the Offensive Line?
I think the OL should have stats like Pass Blocking and Run Blocking at a minium. Strength and Execution just don't cut it from an Oline Standpoint. I can see where your going with the Execution stand point, but there are some Tackles who can run block but can't pass block, etc.
Same goes for Defensive Lineman. You have Lineman who are more suited for Run Stopping, and some who are more suited for Pash Rushing. Having Stars of Speed, Agility, and Strength, don't tell me how good hs pash rush moves are, because there have been Fast Strong Ends who simply can't get off his block, or Strong Tackles who simply can't stay on there feet.
I hope Execution gets dumbed down a bit and some of the non glamour positions get a little more detailed.
celamantia
January 16, 2011 at 09:36PM View BBCode
Originally posted by EdSales87
I think the OL should have stats like Pass Blocking and Run Blocking at a minium.
They do; this list is out of date.
Same goes for Defensive Lineman. You have Lineman who are more suited for Run Stopping, and some who are more suited for Pash Rushing.
Same here; these abilities do exist now.
--Chris
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